I personally don’t like these QRPs or qualified retirement plans (Roth-IRA, Solo 401ks, etc) if you are an active real estate investor. But if you have money locked up in an old IRA or 401k this is a great way to get that money out to invest in your deals or syndications.
If you are conservatively using prudent leverage and finding decent deals there is no reason you should not be able to retire in 10 years or less and thus negating the very reason for these accounts. I don’t know about you but I want access to this money to play with well before I am sixty-something.
When you have money in these accounts it sounds good that you are not taxed on gains but you are restricted from getting a Fannie Mae loan. Using the QRP loans get you the second tier financing options, for example, a Roth IRA can buy real estate on leverage, however, will need a non-recourse loan which is often a fraction high-interest rate and lower LTV. No Bueno!
Info on using retirement funds for syndication deals:
Question: I am considering investing in a 506c investment on a multifamily property. They are raising a 1 million from investors, then getting a loan and making improvements to the property and repositioning it over 5-7 years. I wanted to use my funds from my SEP IRA which is currently in a qualified intermediary trust. What is the UBIT tax? Will I be subject to that on this deal? Also, should I set up an LLC that then loans the money to their LLC? How can I structure this for tax and liability benefits?
Answer [Note: From CPA and not this is NOT legal or professional advice]: When you invest in a business (syndicate = business) with your IRA, the IRA will be subject to UBIT (unrelated business income tax) and UDFI (unrelated debt financed income).
For our purposes, UDFI is produced when an IRA uses debt to purchase real estate. Essentially, the portion of the property’s income considered UDFI is based on the percentage of rental income derived from debt.
For example, Property A is purchased for $100,000. You put down 25% of the purchase price as a down payment and finance the remaining 75% with a traditional mortgage from the bank. The property produces $10,000 in net income for the year. $7,500 (75%) of the net income is considered UDFI and is subject to UBIT.
There is a deduction for the first $1,000 of income subject to UBIT. Income subject to UBIT over $1,000 is taxed at trust rates. For 2017, trust tax rates start at 15% and max out at 39.6% after just $12,400 of income subject to UBIT.
UBIT is paid by the IRA account. If for whatever reason UBIT is paid directly by the taxpayer, the amount paid is considered a contribution to the IRA.
Follow up question: Is there any difference in how the UDFI will apply for these:
1) SD IRA
3) Solo 401K
4) SD IRA (operated as an LLC) so this one is confusing… My LLC owns an LLC (syndication) which owns a property such as 150-unit on 123 main street
Question: I’m trying to decide if one is better than another for tax purposes?
Answer: The solo 401(k) is not subject to UDFI but it subject to UBIT. The IRAs are all subject to UBIT and UDFI. Note that generally the passive income flowing back to you is very low and the, as a result, we don’t see a huge UBIT tax.
Another idea would be to take a debt position (lending) rather than equity. The interest you would receive is free of UBIT and UDFI tax.
(This suggestion of a “debt” position or note investment with the SEP IRA to avoid UBIT and UDFI tax is a creative one… but it’s a very low chance of happening because it’s just too complicated and honestly not worth the effort from the syndicators’ side. It’s a very similar case of to a Tenant-In-Common (TIC) arrangement where an investor has 1031 exchange funds and wants to parlay that money into a syndication. It’s possible but from the syndicator’s perspective a lot of unneeded work when you can just raise the funds the traditional way. Caveat: if you are bringing in a huge amount of money say 50% of the raise then that might tip the scales in your favor)
Ask you can tell this is a really grey area. One CPA mentioned, the answer depends on how you structured the syndication, UBIT may or may not apply for the real estate holding for solo 401k. I would really try to toss the Operation Agreement to your individual CPAs to examine and determine ahead of time as I am not a CPA 😉
Caveat: If you are late to the game and already have a fat 401k then you should convert it to a solo401k. At that point, you should think about putting it into a syndication since you are restricted on how you can leverage it.
So if you are going to have one of these QRP accounts since you have an old 401K or old retirement accounts want to self-direct it in good investments and don’t want to take a huge tax hit right away set up a Solo401k or Checkbook control.
This is the first property in a series (1 out of 9) of acquisitions that resulted from a couple 1031 exchanges. If this is your first time reading this post I suggest you read these few prefaces first.
This property was put into service in October of 2015 (I know a little behind but I’ll catch up in the next few months). I acquired the property from a marketer that makes connections with the rehabbers in certain markets and finds buyers such as myself who are typically located in low rent to value ratio locations (this does not necessarily mean high-priced locations) such as California, New York, Hawaii, Seattle, Portland, and basically the coastal areas where all the cool kids what to actually live. Marketers have their place if the buyer is totally clueless but once you purchase a few of these properties the marketer really does not offer much value. The only thing I see that they would offer would be someone to be the bad guy role in a negotiation but many of the marketers are buddy-buddy with the rehabber because of their business relationship and won’t stick their neck out for you. As the buyer, you need to take ownership of the due-diligence process and negotiations because that marketer is not a licensed agent and does not have a fiduciary responsibility to you.
Check out my previous post for a bit more context. My goal was straight cashflow so Memphis and Birmingham were at the top of my list as opposed to Atlanta/Texas which seemed to trade off some cashflow buffer for appreciation potential. I was comfortable going with a seemingly grungier city because I was going for cashflow (rent/value). A wise mentor of mine told me once “the security of your investment in a market correction is how much cashflow/buffer there is from between your rent minus expenses… when bad times come, how much can you lower the rent to ride out the bad times.” I think most people get wrapped around in analysis paralysis over the plethora of data such as crime stats, employment trends, population trends, etc. Those indicators tell part of the story but for me the reason I moved forward was just talking to a couple of people who were (not referral based salesmen) investors with disinterested agendas that said “dude, just buy it (from the right people), it just works”. If you have ever heard the saying “stand on the shoulders of giants” that’s what I did – if it worked for these other investors then I’m just going to start where they left off – after all every month I delayed action I lost a potential $200-300 of cashflow. In the end, maybe it’s just because of my personality, I chose Birmingham because I heard so many podcast ads for Memphis and saw all the investors going there.
I apologize, it has been so long that it’s hard to remember (again I will get better at this, scouts honor), but I can’t really remember much because there were really no huge exceptions in the due-diligence process. I did a 3rd party inspector that I got off a referral from other investors. Remember do not take a referral from anyone on the sellers side as that is a huge red flag for their integrity due to the conflict of interest. A big difference in my growth as an investor is running these processes together with the lender’s parallel process and being able to effectively negotiate additional renovations or contract terms. Looking back I probably over paid a few thousand at least more than I would have today with my experience because you just can’t read about this stuff. Also it’s worth noting that you always should connect with a few property management companies and interview them early in this period. In addition, use them to validate your rental numbers and property location.
I paid cash for the property initially because it was the sellers terms. I would never it do it again this way since I basically waived my right to a property appraisal. The next step was to refinance the property with a convention Fannie Mae mortgage to pull out most of my initial investment. We had a lot of trouble getting the property to appraise for the value due to the technical processes of the appraisers. Finally, after the third try I finally got an appraisal number that I was able to live with, but the damage had been done and I had to have all my cash tied up in the deal for 2-3 months. Lesson learned was to always have a financing/appraisal contingency to ensure that the property that you buy appraises and that what you pay is what it is worth. This is another example of a standing on the shoulder of giants, when you are financing from day 1 the bank owns 75-80% of the home via the mortgage and they are doing their due diligence too via the title work and appraisal. Therefore use the banks process as your friend. I got a lot of help from my lender in this transaction as they were the ones behind the scenes working the appraisal issue. This the difference between going with any big bank lender and a lender that works exclusively with investors. Again the golden rule is to always go by referral by another investor.
After the smoke cleared I was out of pocket $27K and had a $50k mortgage. The interest rate was a little under 5% but that does not matter. Sophisticated investors do not look at interest rate and the amount of debt instead they focus on cashflow and effect on net worth because after all who cares if your interest rate is 8% if the deal is returning 20-40%.
After all the closing issues got taken care of everything else went pretty smooth and the property got filled by a nice family. Here are the numbers:
5 Rooms/3 Bed/1Bath, 1 story, 1008 SF
The Story: A nice suburban home in the Center Point area. The property was picked up as a distressed seller and rehabbed
$875 Rent per month
– 10% Property management
– In the first 18 months I have less than 400 dollars of repairs total
– $395 Mortgage/Interest/Insurance/Taxes (PITI)
I typically get $300-400 per month after expenses. Please note: Make sure you are saving 30-50% at least in reserves for cap ex, expenses, repairs, vacancy. I have had good luck these first 18 months however the law of averages will catch up.
Knock on wood – it really does not get any better than this property because in the first 18 months of ownership I have experienced no vacancy and only $300 of repairs. 🙂 So yea things are pretty boring on this one.
“My wife is officially is quitting her job at the end of this year. Thanks for helping us be able to do that. One of her friends had to go back to work 10-weeks after having their second kid because they need her income to pay the mortgage. It makes me cringe just thinking about that.” –Hui Deal Pipeline Club Member
The typical SimplePassiveCashflow tribe member asks a lot of questions.. Why do I have to work 40 years at my JOB? Why do the wealthy always get ahead? Why do I stay up late at night reading Quora?
I know I was beating the drum of the Turnkey rental a few years ago but I am admittedly a work in progress and this is my journey.
Sign up for the mailing list and join the free web course “Journey to Simple Passive Cashflow.”
Preview of what is to come in my jump start to cashflow guide that encompasses all the lessons in the past few years…
Week #1 – Introduction to the “Journey to Simple Passive Cashflow”
Week #2 – Seeing the Matrix – You will know why the middle class is shrinking and what you can do to continue your same standard of living
Week #3 – About Me – Learn about my background and why I have the formula for high paid working professionals to escape the rat race
Week #4 – Real Estate Investing from a 30,000 foot view part 1 – You will understand real estate investing and all the options. We will cut through the noise and identify what are the best options for the high paid professional
Week #5 – Real Estate Investing from a 30,000 foot view Part 2 – Continuation with the addition of downloadable tools
Week #6 – A free special gift
Week #7 – Fundamentals – You will get to know the basics of what every investor needs to know without reading a gazillion books or going through hours of boring podcasts
Week #8 – In-Field Experience – A guide to effectively network and build your investor circle
Week #9 – 2018 Trends – The Fundamentals don’t change but the market climate changes so here is the latest market report and things to be on the lookout for
Week #10 – Buying a Rental Property Part 1: Acquisition – Start shopping for deals and refine your criteria to be able to spot out your next addition to your growing portfolio
Week #11 – Buying a Rental Property Part 2: Lending – You can’t buy anything and use leverage effectively if you don’t know the basics of using the bank to your advantage.
Week #12– Buying a Rental Property Part 3: Operation – Congratulations you are a rental property owner but that’s only half the battle. Now we focus on managing the manager so we can optimize our returns.
Week #13 – Buying a Rental Property Part 4: Mentorship/Networking – You net worth is your network. Don’t be that guy who repels help and good ideas and the last person to hear of the latest trends or work with bad vendors.
Week #14 – Half-Way Point! – Build your portfolio with the end in mind and with a holistic approach
Week #15 – Syndications + Apartments Part 1 – Understand why most sophisticated investors scale up to larger investments
Week #16 – Syndications + Apartments Part 2 – Find out how you can get access to deals once only accessible to the wealthy within the country club
Week #17 – Investor Mindset – Once you get started you realize that the possibilities are endless (I know it sounds cheesy but some people sign the front of the checks and some people sign the back)
Week #18 – Productivity – Following up mindset the limiting factor might be the fact that you suck at getting things done. Here are some of the best tips to increasing your output and having more time to do what you want to do.
Week #19 – Taxes – You will learn what you will need to know to prevent legal chrn from a lawyer who does not know what they are doing
Week #20 – HELOCS/Refinancing – A great way to find lazy money to put to cashflowing rental real estate
Week #21 – 1031 Exchanges – Don’t be fooled but this talked about tax strategy. It is often not what cutting edge investors use.
Week #22 – QRPs – Got funds locked up in retirement funds? Lets free that lazy equity!
Week #23 – Life Insurance Banking – Its called life insurance but its use by the wealthy to bank from yourself and avoid taxes.
Week #24 – Other Financial Hacks – Other secrets I pick up by hanging out with wealthy people
Week #25 – Covering your assets – You will learn some ways to build legal protections around your financial empire
Week #26 – Conclusion – Pulling together the basic and advanced topics for you
This is the stuff you don’t hear talked about from co-workers!
Most so-called financial planners don’t even have a clue – although they are probably a nice guy.
These are the secrets of the uber-wealthy and specific mentorship groups that I have spent over $40,000 to learn over the past few years.
All too often I see hard-working people with good jobs struggling to get by.
These are the same people who are forced to take stressful promotions at work, commuting in the car for a couple hours a day (hopefully listening to the SimplePassiveCashflow.com podcast), going home to the home they think they own but in reality, they are just a slave to the mortgage company.
These “good citizens” are victims of an engineered system to keep then investing in 401Ks, mutual funds, and stocks.
This financial system is setup where the insiders are stealing the majority of your returns (and you take all the risk – to learn more about this go to SimplePassiveCashflow.com/FP).
Welcome if you are new! And welcome back… here is what I have been working on…
1 ) Just closed my second syndication in my own name. If you want access to these opportunities they are only available to folks with a pre-existing relationship. So sign up for my Hui Deal Pipeline Club and setup a time to chat.
Hui Deal Pipe Club acquisition stats (Estate-2016)- Acquired over $90M dollars of total real estate and $8 million dollars of funds raised.
4) I stopped looking for deals… I only hunt the hunters to partner with if the deal makes sense. Not to sound high and mighty but after doing this podcast thing for a few years I have reached “critical mass” for social capital and deals are now coming my way. There are about twenty deals I get from brokers in my email everyday and a few syndication deals that are pitched to me every month.
5) I’m just trying to find happiness. Read along on my personal newsletter by signing up here.
Goal: Turn “C” and “B” class properties, 60-300 units (stabilized with value-add opportunity) with at least 75% LTV/25 year amortization. We plan to hold 3-6 years and sell when we have doubled our investors’ money. Utilize Non-Recourse debt for extra security.
Seeking MFH at least 60 – 250 units.
1. Value-add component: typically 85-90% occupancy for non-recourse loan & discount based on condition or motivated seller
2. Price: $1,500,000 – $9,000,000, per unit cost under $55K.
3. Location: secondary and tertiary markets across
4. Class: D/C/B Property in a B/A neighborhood
Current holdings as of co-owner of MFPE Investments LLC (1400+ units in OK, LA, IA, TX, and WA)
“I read a book called, “The Millionaire Next Door” and it explained why my pain points were motivating for me, and how I channeled that frustration into something productive…the desire to make my family proud and ‘come up’ in life and pull my family into a better socioeconomic situation, and to ‘have what others have but i never could’ but somewhere along the way, I learned quickly that the ‘having of stuff’ is not what brings happiness so I dont pursue the shiniest of immaterial things… just the MED…. minimum effective dose of what I truly want which is surround myself with a few quality people and necessary things to subsist on than a bunch of trendy new things and fads that will fall off eventually” . –Hui Deal Pipeline Club Member
Networking with other Buy-Hold investors I discovered 2 things:
1) Passive investors are hard to spot out among the typically ‘active’ RE crowd that are majority at most local REIA meetings. Trading best practices was very difficult and I got lost in the fix and flipper group think mentally too.
Always consider the source of your advise.. I think we can all agree that going to your mom/dad for financial advice may or may not be the best place to go.. Sure they may be retired but consider the path the took to get there with different circumstances.. In 2015, I started to realize that going to my local Real Estate investing group was probably not the best place for me to go.. I started to pay a lot more to get into more qualified groups and conferences and I found that mostly everyone were real investors and not just Wantrepreneurs.. I got even more focused and as an engineer still working the day job I sought out groups with other investors who were primarily working professionals (doctors, lawyers, accountants, engineers).. A lot of these people were a little older than me which helped me find my highest and best use as an investor but gave me a high-level view of how to put together a holistic life plan.. An example of this happened the other day when I asked my guy at the Mercedes dealership what other people do with their leases do at the expiration of their contract.. Notice I would not ask that at the Honda dealership because people there don’t lease their cars.. By the way I don’t know why you would want to buy a card…. I did the math.. The takeaway is find people who are similar to your pedigree in terms of time/money/knowledge/network and use those as role models.. Grant Cardone has a saying “who’s got my money” which I think is misinterpreted as a war cry to get out there and make money.. I take it as a subtle hint to find those who have what you want and they “type” of money (active or passive).
2) Passive investing is often boring since this is not a get rich quick method of building wealth and uneventful (if things are going well there aren’t too many cool stories).
This podcast and blog are meant to distill content just to the golden nuggets for the passive Real Estate Investor. I plan to go beyond the newbie tips that clutter the internet and cocktail parties because lets’ face it, as a passive investor your time should be spent on things that you love to do and those who are important to you (not trolling real estate internet forums or making makeshift plumbing repairs on your property).
As I get more experienced, I recognize that there are a lot quicker ways to make a lot of money in Real Estate such as apartment investing, flipping high-end properties, or development but for the time being I have a full-time job that is alright and until that changes this is the path that I have zeroed in on. So if you are like me, join me on this train and if you don’t like your job and want to quit you can get on board too we will wake you up when it’s your time to escape the rat-race.
Real Estate has empowered me financially I wanted to give back to the investor community.
“Overwhelmed by the amount of stuff is on SimplePassiveCashflow.com? Don’t know where the heck to start? Text the word “simple” to 314-665-1767 for the curated course to get you up to speed on the past two years of content.”
My Motivation For Creating this Site:
1) Begin with the end in mind and decide now what you want your obituary to read. We are only here on this earth for a finite period. I like this picture because this is what will probably be on the welcome table at my funeral. I hope you can make it! Rich Cohen wrote that there are four rungs of being remembered after death: “newly dead; dead but remembered; dead and all those who knew you dead; dead and all those who knew those who knew you dead.” In terms of YOU…All that matters is what happens when you’re alive. Your legacy will offer you no pleasure after you’ve passed so live how you dream but know that there are some unconventional paths that you have to take (like buying cashflowing rentals not in your home state). And for myself…fame will do you no favors for me once I die but at least people can use SimplePassiveCashflow.com to get out of the rat race. And if that does not get your going listen to the wisdom of Frank Ostaseski.
2) Create a repository of information where my unborn children or others can reference with some context into what I was thinking. Similar to Seattle Seahawk, Marshawn Lynch’s “Beast-Mode”, I have tried to live my life in “Legacy-Mode”. And I really want to have a real book!
Why a Podcast?
I jumped on the podcast ban-wagon in 2007 while I was working on the road when I did not have a friend near me. It got me into Crossfit in 2008, Paleo in 2009, Real estate investing in 2010, intermittent fasting in 2013, internet marketing in 2015, and led to meeting and creating friendships with a lot of you because we are aligned on the same wavelength. Yes… The phrase “we met on the internet” is totally acceptable! Obviously, a few of these interests have come and gone but in the macro sense, podcasts have instilled a lifelong interest and ability to learn.
When you ask a kindergartner how do you make money? Why don’t they say “invest in cashflowing real estate?” Because their parents don’t have a clue!
3) While I am alive I want to teach/empower others to fish for themselves. In real estate, we use leverage and by teaching others, I am leveraging other people to achieve their financial goals in hopes that they will pay it forward. I poke fun at MLMs a lot but I would like to create a pyramid scheme of philanthropy.
What is the change that you want to make in the world even if its a 1% move in the needle? Financial education – people have such struggle so much to make ends meet.
I was baptized on Easter 2016 and searched for a way to give back. I want to help others but I struggle with giving money away because I know I can grow my money much faster and I am much more frugal than any philanthropic organization. Bill Gates gave back only after he amassed a fortune. Tithing as you go along has a smaller cumulative impact. My end game is to give away my wealth to rightful causes via a Charitable Remainder Trust.
4) I hope my blog/podcast will help families realize the powerful wealth-building effects of real estate so they can spend their time on more important, instead of working long hours and worrying about their financial troubles. There are a lot of successful families with good jobs (teachers/engineers/programmers/finance) yet they struggle to make ends meet financially. It is their kiddos who ultimately get the short end of the stick. (Cool graphs on this subject) Being a Latch-Key Child growing up, both my parents had to work and I was left home alone after school to fiddle with my thumbs.
With Real Estate you are able to grow your wealth exponentially faster than the conventional 401K’s and stock investing, therefore you are able to escape the dogma of working 50+ hour weeks at a job that is unfulfilling. And if you are one of the lucky ones who happen to do what you enjoy… well good for you 😛
As a great time in history to be alive with general peace and technological convinced, I see a silent war being waged upon the shrinking Middle Class. This is the Civil Rights movement of my time. In a way, people are having a Stockholm Syndrome with Wall Street profiteers being the captors. Let’s work together to redirect money from the Wall-Street casinos and corrupt financial institutions…To help the endangered ‘Middle Class’ savers find safer, more profitable investments in Main Street opportunities benefiting local communities.
“I wanted to say thank you to all of the Simple Passive Cashflow listeners. The content has been all over the place from Turnkey Rentals to Turkey Rentals and now to syndications and private placements. The feedback from some of you is that it has been a bit of a roller coaster or “Korean Drama” to follow the websites content. To memorialize the past and de-cuttler the past two years of content I have created a FREE web course to get you up to speed by texting the word “simple” to 314-665-1767.”
Why this podcast/website/syndicating deals is the perfect storm:
Self-awareness is truly the most important aspect of being an investor/entrepreneur. My job being a syndicator is to find opportunities and lead other investors like you to them and using my podcast and experience makes this a logical step for me. I always encourage folks to find out what their competitive advantages and disadvantages are. I can usually help point people in the right direction in a 15-minute free chat – Click here to schedule.
By doing the podcast I found that there was a lot of things and people that I did not know. As Robert Half says, “When one teaches, two learn.”
What are my downfalls?
Being an engineer and introvert communicating was something I was never good at. However, I think I get it after hearing these “straight from the 1990’s salesmen.” I don’t like to waste people’s time, no tricks, no games, the deals should sell themselves.
What is my competitive advantage?
1) I don’t have kids. After learning about hundreds of listens situations via free calls I hear that this sorta complicates things… 😛
2) I am an ISTJ (introversion, sensing, thinking, judgment abbreviation used in the publications of the Myers–Briggs Type Indicator). I don’t really know what the last three manifest in my life but I am a recovering introvert – a side hobby is this group I started to help others get out of their shell. I believe an introvert has nothing to do if you like people or if you are loud and annoying. Your affinity is determined where you derive your energy. Going to the day job and working with you know “others” was really tiring for me. The weirdest thing is that when I talk to others over the phone or in-person I get so excited and sometimes a little too passionate. That’s how I knew I was on to something. I’ll say it many times but what really fires me up is redirecting money from the Wall-Street casinos and corrupt financial institutions…To help the endangered ‘Middle Class’ savers find safer, more profitable investments in Main Street opportunities benefiting local communities. And it would be awesome to help out people in Hawaii where I now live where so many struggles with finances. I’m not looking to change the world just a portion of it.
3) I do recognize that there are seasons in life and right now I am accelerating my syndication business along with my own investments via my Hui Deal Pipeline Club. Sign up here.
Right now my goal is to get to $10-15k per month of passive cashflow as fast as I can. Once I get there, I plan to put things into cruise control. Sophisticated investors call this going from the “growth stage” to hitting “critical mass”. At that point, I will continue to help others get where they want to be via my syndication business which creates good options for passive investors with so little time on their hands. I trust that at this point deals and opportunities will fall into my lap and the Hui.
4) Some people say they work smart. Bust guess what? I work smart and work hard (2-4 hours every day after I get home from the day job). Right now I am working at a pretty unsustainable pace but I am motivated by being so close to activating cruise control.
5) I don’t think binary. I see the world as shades of grey and zero-sum trade-offs when win-win deals can’t be made. I am able to evaluate deals analytically and make holistic decisions. I seem like a machine sometimes but don’t act like one 😉 Robert Kiyosaki says “there are always three sides to a coin.”
6) Integrity – Through these podcast interviews, I had the idea beat into my head not to chase money. I did it in my W2 career in construction management trading money for a poor quality of life working in something I did not like with people who were jerks. Being a younger investor, I realized that was going to hit “zero-gravity” or financial freedom well before my 40s. And then what the heck would I do??? I plan on doing this for a while… at least a few market cycles. I always wanted to act with my investors best interests in mind. The last thing I want to do is not act ethically and have someone put a hit on me as I check my mail at my PO Box.
“I started the Hui Deal Pipeline Club because I want to see each of you get to your goals financially so you can focus on what is really important to you. There are other fundraisers out there that will train their investors down to 10-15% IRRs on crappy deals and do “deals to do deals” or to pick up acquisition fees. Between investing alongside you folks and wanted to grow my track record the right way with the best product I know you guys will keep coming back and bring your friends.”
“Are you absolutely bored at social gatherings because everyone is super passionate about their JOB and too shameful to get naked and talk about their finances? Been drinking the SimplePassiveCashflow Latte (got your own coffee parcel) and feeling a little lonely? Re-engage your friends having them text the word “simple” to 314-665-1767 to begin the Free web course “The Journey to Simple Passive Cashflow” so they can get back up to speed with financial independence and investing. Remember if you don’t tell them now about it who are you going to have mid-day lunches with when everyone else is still at the day-job.”
If you are new to the site here are the recommended posts to read if you had a couple hours:
Please do me a favour and share with your friends. Because you can change someone’s life.
“I started the Hui Deal Pipeline Club because I want to see each of you get to your goals financially so you can focus on what is really important to you. There are other fundraisers out there that will train their investors down to 10-15% IRRs on crappy deals and do “deals to do deals” or to pick up acquisition fees. Between investing alongside you folks and wanted to grow my track record the right way with the best product I know you guys will keep coming back and bring your friends.
SimplePassiveCashflow.com is for working professionals who are looking for diversification and better returns outside of traditional investments such as mutual funds and stocks. The Hui Deal Pipeline Club is a free investor club where I filter investments and underwrite the numbers and partners myself. Unlike other investor lists and groups, my investors have personal access to me and know that I personally have skin in the game investing alongside with my investors.
Let’s work together to redirect money from the Wall-Street casinos and corrupt financial institutions…To help the endangered ‘Middle Class’ savers find safer, more profitable investments in Main Street opportunities benefiting local communities.”
My promise to my readers: No click bait here on SimplePassiveCashflow.com – all the tips will be provided on the SAME page, so relax! For real estate investors at some point, you are going to need to do a 1031 exchange. Having just done two of them, I wanted to share my experience before I forget it (since its sort of a pain in the butt and people forget painful things). Hopefully, it will help you create a game plan going in.
So no investor is left behind, a 1031 exchange is a way to defer your capital gains from a sale of real property. This is one of the advantages of real estate as compared to stocks or other assets. I am no lawyer or CPA, but basically, you have 180 days from the sale of your first/subject property to exchange into “like kind” investments using the proceeds (sale price minus existing mortgage and sales costs). This transaction needs to be done via an intermediary/custodian who sets up an escrow to create the paper trail for your upcoming taxes. This process is something you don’t want to DIY because if you screw up, you are going have to pay taxes on the proceeds, plus all that depreciation (recapture) you benefited from. Oh and one more kicker… once you sell the subject property you have 45 days to create a list that identifies all potential replacement properties, but more on that in a bit.
So now that the newbies have caught up there are the tips:
1) Haveproperties ready to go: This means having a purchase and sale agreement signed and having completed the negotiation before the subject property (the home you are exchanging/selling) closes. As the close date for the sale of your subject property gets closer (~2 weeks) and especially if it’s a slam-dunk transaction (i.e., the buyer is bringing cash to close/no financing), you might want to take the risk and execute those purchase and sale contracts sooner. Note that this is a bit shady to your agent because if complications do arise then you will have to cancel your contract and no one will like you L
2) Don’t screw around. Get your inspections done as a soon as possible. Knowing if you are going to move forward or abort the purchase of a property is super important. Remember other than the 180 day time limit the other properties on you 45-day list could be bought by other investors.
3) Work with a real estate attorney who has experience with a 1031 Exchange: Policies regarding 1031s will vary from year to year with changes in the Tax Code. Once you sell your property, you will also need someone to hold your funds in escrow, because you are not able to take possession of the funds. If you do take possession of the funds from the sale of your property, the 1031 exchange won’t work anymore. But good thing you found that lawyer that will do this all full service for you.
Rumor has it that the silly escrow rule was created when some guy took the proceeds from the sale of his property to Las Vegas and blew all his money on rocks and hookers. After that, the Government was like, “These people are idiots, we can’t let this happen.” So that guy ruined it for everyone, and now we have to all follow this arduous process.
Pick that lawyer and have all of the contractual details worked out before the subject property goes under contract to sell. Expect to pay $500-$1200 plus additional fees for each property you acquire. Talk to your lawyer and get educated about all the rules, such as the 200% rule, 45-day list, 180-day rule, what is eligible to write off, and get them to sign off on your plan. Remember these guys know how to do 1031s, and it’s ultimately your job to get the big picture right. That’s why you’re the boss.
4) The All-Important 45-Day Rule: As mentioned earlier you need to create a list of potential properties that you can acquire before the 45th day after the sale of your subject property. The rules change on these 1031s all the time (see disclaimer below) but I was only able to identify up to 200% of the subject property’s value which for me was eight properties for $800k, since the subject property sold for about $400k. (I don’t know where this rule came from, but it was probably conceived by Vegas, hookers, and rocks) What I would do about 10 days prior to the deadline of your 45-day list, send out an emailblast to all your agents, turnkey providers, long lost wholesalers (you know the folks you exchange info and you never hear from again like an ex-college classmate) and basically do a roll call for all properties. This is a time to call (not email/text) to explain your situation. Set broad constraints, and specify that you need X properties from each provider that you will buy X of them. This will let the sellers know that you are serious, and they may move mountains for you and bump you up in the priority line. This may also eliminate the silly negotiation process and get you the best pricing. The beauty of doing this is that you are creating a competitive bid format and will ultimately fill up your 45-day-list with the best candidates.
5) Have a Backup Plan: When soliciting for your 45-day-list, you may also want to ask for properties that aren’t ready to be sold yet but “are in the pipeline.” For example, these are the properties that have just been picked up by the seller from an auction or those where a wholesaler is in discussion with the first seller, and the rehab has not begun. Fast forward a couple months, and suppose a few properties on your 45-day-list fall through due to a bad inspection, you are going to need to go back to your list and if you had properties that were ready to be sold at that time of the 45-day-list creation, a lot of them will be sold by then. In summary, this is where adding in the sleeper picks or prospects makes building your list complicated. You need to really meditate with a “Simple Passive Cashflow Latte” and think of every angle.
6) Your 1031 facilitator, gets paid when you do a 1031 exchange. Your lender gets paid when you refinance. Your Bank gets paid when you set up a HELOC. Each are a tool and every situation is unique. Is a 1031 really your best option? Sorry if this point is a bit late in the conversation, but I am assuming you are reading this article before showing up to the Toga Party with your loin cloth.
7) Do your own research on a “Reverse 1031 exchange”. It’s a bit more expensive but might be the right tool for the job, however, it is not for the situation where you are trading one property for many. Personally, I think it’s a tool for a really unique situation and it’s not worth discussing, but I’m sure a Lawyer will want to tell you all about it at their $300/per hour billable rate.
8) Get Everyone on the Same Page: Have a good old-fashioned, conference call to get your lender and 1031 facilitator on the same page. Isn’t it great to be the leader of a conference call for something meaningful this time? Funny Video. But what is not funny is getting that call from the lender who uses the underwriter as an excuse for why you can’t get a loan a couple weeks before the close. That phone call is totally avoidable with proper communication upfront to ensure you can qualify for the loans with the proper debt to income (DTI) requirements and Cash Reserves. As of June 2016, you need six months of PITI for your first four loans, but loans #4-10 need six months for ALL properties. When I was trying to close loan #10, I needed about $33,000 dollars of cash reserves just sitting there ($550x6x10). This makes an optimizer like myself really irritated. Luckily you can use ~100% of 401k or Roth accounts. Just a last month they allowed you to only count 70% so you can see how that rules change. Also in terms of cash reserves, make sure you have consulted with your lender about the required amount of time you need to season the funds in your bank account.
Also depending on your 1031 facilitator, you might be able to talk them into paying the appraisal fees out of the 1031 funds instead of out of pocket. I got my lender to reverse the charges and bill the appraisal fee at closing. Unfortunately, the home inspector will likely want to be paid via cold hard cash because he (Let’s be honest…it’s always a guy) is running a good old-fashioned cash business. Just kidding, he takes credit card too. Did I mention that you should relax through this 1031 ordeal? Now, is the time for yourself to enjoy an Old-Fashion or other alcoholic beverage, you are almost done.
9) Use It Or Lose It: As you are getting to the end of your 1031 timeline and utilizing most of the 1031 funds, you are going to have to decide to use it all or leave some money unutilized. Typically you will have to pay taxes on the remaining (this remaining is called “the boot”). You are going to be faced with decisions to pick up properties that are less than desirable or walk from the deal (and pay the taxes on the unutilized funds). Case in point, say the last property needs $30K to close the deal but the seller is dragging their feet with final punch list repairs that came from the inspection. The seller is refusing to replace the roof because the roof is 15 years old and has a few good years left. Therefore, the seller does not want to pay $10K to fix it per your request. Let’s do the math, if you walk from the deal you pay ~25% of the $30k due to tax implications of not utilizing the funds and pay the government almost $8k. Armed with this information, it would be logical to suggest that the seller pays half of the roof costs ($5k) as it is a good business decision for you to make this concession and not pay the taxes on the boot (5K<8K). This is a simple example, but this is how the decision needs to be analyzed. Also, keep in mind, information is power. If the seller knew that you were in the late stages of your 1031 and you did not have any other potential 1031 properties to go after on your 45-day-list or nearing the 180-day deadline you would be at their mercy. But that’s negotiation, which can be a fancy 52-card game of BS.
10) Just take it day by day: It is not easy, but it’s simple…LOL. This is where you are glad you picked an investor focused lender who has done these things before instead of the neighborhood big bank. Again make sure you keep the line of communication open with your lender (every few days) to avoid large surprises.
11) A 1031 Exchange is Not for Beginners: If you have not purchased a rental property before I would try to buy one outside of a 1031 to test the agent, lender, market, and especially yourself. The 1031 is going to require you to have many plates spinning at once. It is best to first figure out the nuances with a simple one-off transaction.
Which property class or property value range would be best to put on the buying list?
This is ultimately up to your investing strategy and criteria. For me to tell you what is the best is irresponsible and against what I believe, because you should understand the macro (not micro) concepts for yourself and make your own best individual strategy. With that disclaimer out of the way, I originally went (my personal strategy changes over time) after B/B+ properties that rented for at least $1000 per month and had at least 3 bed and 2 bath. This strategy evolves as my portfolio grows. #1stWorldInvestorProblems. Some things to think of when finding your strategy/criteria include:
Although I fully intend to hold on to these properties indefinitely for cashflow, I recognize that things change, and perhaps I might want to trade in one “goose that lays the golden egg” for two or three “geese that lay the golden egg” or one “big ass goose that yea you get the point.” To say, “My properties are generating cashflow” is a fallacy. Instead, you have to evaluate what the numbers say on the bottom of the spreadsheet and compare the two situations you are evaluating. You should always be making moves to optimize your return, assuming it warrants the transaction costs.
I was using Fannie Mae loans, which are those sweet government subsidized 30-year fixed loans. At the time of this writing (5/2016) the most one person can have is 10 to their name (If you are smart also 10 in your married partner’s name too). Your plan might be to only get one or two homes and sail off into the sunset, but your plan might change and you have to change your plan for the “if” in life. To acquire a conventional Fannie/Freddie non-owner occupied property requires 20-25% down payment. There are also lender costs, which I typically estimate at $5000 +/- $1000. Parts of the lender costs are variable, such as an origination loan (basically it’s their fee to have to deal with you and headaches you cause them). Origination fees are typically a certain percentage (~1%) of the final loan, but the rate varies from lender to lender, so this is something you are comparing. Other parts of the lender costs are fixed costs such as inspection costs, credit reports, and appraisal fees. It is these fixed costs that are the same whether you buy a $40K property or a $140K property. This is one reason I personally went after a more expensive property.
By buying 50K properties that rent for $800 you’re like “Hey that’s awesome that’s a 1.6+% Rent to Value Ratio”. But I suggest reading my article about the nuances of the RV Ratio and property classes. I promise you there is a graph and I’ll show you where I think where the cool kids are investing on the class spectrum. Remember the goal is to maximize the profit, which is the rent minus expenses (and the mortgage if you finance the property). Folks get wrapped around all these metrics, but do not forget the goal.
This is totally my strategy, but please think for yourself: When I was getting started I went for the higher priced properties (Not the A properties cause there is no cashflow in there). I went for properties that rent for 1100 that I could get for 100K. I would say these were B+ properties (Note: do not take the seller’s definition). My strategy was to find low hassle properties that had better tenants and properties that I could easily liquidate because they were close to the median home. There is a bit contradiction here because yes, they were safer in terms of tenant quality and exit strategy, but the cashflow buffer was less, so I had less ability to lower rents in a market downturn. Now that I have a stronger base in terms of teams, money, and knowledge I try to go for more C properties because I feel I have the experience and risk tolerance for it (although I stated that these could be safer in terms of the buffer in the cashflow).
Goal: I am selling my home for 600k, and I want to invest out of state for cash flow at $200/month per door.
I think that the per door $200 assumption is in line. There is a difference if you are buying $60K properties or $120K properties but either way, I think you will be beating the averages of the stock market, and that is why I do what I do. One day I will make a video showing the math on the hidden benefits of owning rental real estate.
This is how it is going to work if you choose to sell and do a 1031 exchange. First, you sell the home for $600k (~10% will go to commissions, etc.), so you are left with $540K. This is how much you have to acquire, or there are tax penalties. Therefore, if you are looking at $90K properties, you are going to need to pick up 6 of them. Your cash in your 1031 will be $540k minus your remaining mortgage. You can bring cash out of pocket to make up any shortcomings. Check out this article for more info on some 1031 issues and strategies.
SPC Git Er’ Done Action Plan:
If you’re not doing a 1031… You will need to do one in the future or you are just being silly by hoarding that equity. Today think about the possibility of this exit strategy as you purchase properties. For example, a lot of people talk about buying duplexes, triplexes, and quads, but when it’s time to sell, there is a fraction of possible buyers. And those possible buyers are all investors who are looking to get a deal.
Learn how/why I got out my high priced Seattle (Appreciation) market and into 9 Properties In 5 Months Via 1031 Exchange
Today ends a 9 property, 5 month, buying spree that started back in October 2015 with the sale of my subject Seattle portfolio. I did not know what to call these shenanigans and simply calling it a 1031 did not do it justice. Therefore I will name this feat a “1031-O-Rama” which is inspired by the good old 2008 days where one could apply for a bunch of credit cards with 0% interest. All of you are Real Estate investors and sticking money into a high-interest rewards checking account is kiddie stuff so if you’re ready to go gangbusters here we go…
From 2010-2015, my rentals in Seattle were cash flowing each with 400-600 a month (after vacancy/capex/repairs…), but it was because I bought these properties at the right time so when I tried to buy again in 2015 or early as 2012, prices would not cashflow with typical 20% down financing. My rentals were A+ class and were below the 0.5% Rent to Value Ratio… so amateur, I know. I think everyone would agree that like SF, Seattle has seen great appreciation over the past few years due to the influx of foreign money and tech companies. As a real estate investor you need to always be looking at the numbers and in this case the Return of Deployable Equity (ROE=your sales price minus commissions minus current mortgage balance). By sitting on so much “Lazy Money” in the form of equity I was making less than 5 percent in terms of ROE (The IRR metric is when you buy, the ROE is to evaluate the performance once you are in operation). If the ROE is less than 8 percent/year you are better off in the stock market even though I am not a fan of stocks/mutual funds. Let’s face it, rentals have some risks such as unexpected capital expenses, legal liability, and the low level of overall “PITA” (Pain in the butt). Since 5% < 8%, I needed to re-position my money. Now if this were a Las Vegas movie (funny how appreciation is like gambling) I would be grabbing my chips from the craps table, cashing out at the money cage, and retreating up to my room with my winnings and a beer/pizza.
In the end, I traded two properties via two 1031s that cash flowed a total of $1,000 a month for 10 properties that cash flowed over $3,000 a month (after expenses, vacancy, turn over, capital expenses, and property management). Now I beckon the recession to come because I have more than enough buffer in each individual rental to lower my rents by a couple hundred dollars and since pay the mortgage. A mentor of mine told me that the risk is not the interest rate or amount of debt but the lack of buffer in the spread between your rent, expenses, and mortgage.
Throughout the lending process, I know there must be clones of me with all the DNA samples the lenders/underwriters needed from me (well not really) but it’s a huge PITA to go through the Fannie Mae loan process and execute on multiple loans.You think Fannie loan #1-4 is tough, #5-10 is another level. At any one time I had parallel processes of purchases sale agreements pending, inspections, re-negotiation, inspection punch list, property management interviews and setup, contractor logistics, etc. What a mess. A lot of lenders will recommend that you cross-collateralize your investments so you can get more Fannie Mae loan (max as of now is 10) but I don’t think it should be used in all situations. Remember that loan guy gets paid whenever you originate a loan so of course they are going to recommend it. Also the Fannie Mae loans aren’t really that much better than a portfolio loan…just saying (I can expand on this later in a different article).
On a couple of the properties (#6 of 9 and #9 of 9) I actually didn’t really want them because of things I found in the due-diligence process but I had to close because they were on my “45-day Identified Property List”. I could walk from the deal, but I would have to pay taxes on my unused 1031 funds. The business decision was that it was better to overpay by $6,000 and get the property than have no property and pay the government 25% of $30,000. If you are considering this madness, try not to let your sellers know what you are doing because I got bamboozled by sellers since they knew I had nothing else on my 45-day list of potential properties and HAD to close.
People say that the 180-day deadline is difficult but I would argue that only being able to purchase properties off your 45 day list (period after your subject property closes) is the biggest hurdle and should be really pondered over. A good best practice is to line up your purchase and sale agreement for new acquisition(s) when you are 1-2 weeks before your scheduled closing date so when that date comes…boom you have 5 purchase and sale agreements executed and you are off and running on 45 day closes.
Now I am so relieved to be out of the roller coaster high appreciation Seattle market and in boring appreciation markets. I know that a few years from now someone will read this note that Seattle properties have gone up 2x in value. However, I’m totally content with my passive cashflow portfolio AKA just chillin’ with my yes… that beer and pizza back in the hotel room watching the movie “The Big Short”.
PS: Now I know a lot of folks will say that I have bought lukewarm deals and yea I agree. But all I know is that it’s a lot better than the stock market and they were good deals for a passive investor/level of effort to obtain them not being an active investor. Other side notes.